diff --git a/collects/drracket/private/debug.rkt b/collects/drracket/private/debug.rkt
index 310c194412..358c231a3f 100644
--- a/collects/drracket/private/debug.rkt
+++ b/collects/drracket/private/debug.rkt
@@ -1579,7 +1579,7 @@ profile todo:
   (define profile-unit-frame-mixin
     (mixin (drracket:unit:frame<%> drracket:frame:<%>) ()
       
-      (inherit get-interactions-text get-current-tab)
+      (inherit get-interactions-text get-current-tab set-show-menu-sort-key)
       
       ;; update-shown : -> void
       ;; updates the state of the profile item's show menu
@@ -1600,7 +1600,8 @@ profile todo:
                 (parent show-menu)
                 (callback
                  (λ (x y)
-                   (show-profile-menu-callback))))))
+                   (show-profile-menu-callback)))))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key show-profile-menu-item 207))
       
       (define show-profile-menu-item #f)
       (define profile-gui-constructed? #f)
diff --git a/collects/drracket/private/frame.rkt b/collects/drracket/private/frame.rkt
index 030f7be056..e5b79b321b 100644
--- a/collects/drracket/private/frame.rkt
+++ b/collects/drracket/private/frame.rkt
@@ -628,10 +628,74 @@
       (define/public get-show-menu (λ () show-menu))
       (define/public update-shown (λ () (void)))
       (define/public (add-show-menu-items show-menu) (void))
+      (define sort-menu-sort-keys (make-hasheq))
+      (define/public (set-show-menu-sort-key item val)
+        (cond
+          [sort-menu-sort-keys 
+           (for ([(k v) (in-hash sort-menu-sort-keys)])
+             (when (eq? k item)
+               (error 'set-show-menu-sort-key
+                      "set menu item ~s twice, to ~s and ~s"
+                      (send item get-label)
+                      v val))
+             (when (= v val)
+               (error 'set-show-menu-sort-key
+                      "two menu items have the same val: ~s and ~s"
+                      (send k get-label)
+                      (send item get-label))))
+           (hash-set! sort-menu-sort-keys item val)]
+          [else
+           (error 'set-show-menu-sort-key 
+                  "the sort menu has already been created and its order has been set")]))
       (super-new)
       (set! show-menu (make-object (get-menu%) (string-constant view-menu-label)
                         (get-menu-bar)))
-      (add-show-menu-items show-menu)))
+      (add-show-menu-items show-menu)
+      (sort-show-menu-items show-menu sort-menu-sort-keys)
+      (set! sort-menu-sort-keys #f)))
+  
+  (define (sort-show-menu-items show-menu show-menu-sort-keys)
+    (define items (send show-menu get-items))
+    (for ([itm (in-list items)])
+      (send itm delete))
+    (define (get-key item)
+      (hash-ref show-menu-sort-keys item 
+                (λ () 
+                  (define lab
+                    (cond
+                      [(is-a? item labelled-menu-item<%>)
+                       (send item get-label)]
+                      [else ""]))
+                  (cond 
+                    [(regexp-match #rx"^Show (.*)$" lab)
+                     => (λ (x) (list-ref x 1))]
+                    [(regexp-match #rx"^Hide (.*)$" lab)
+                     => (λ (x) (list-ref x 1))]
+                    [else lab]))))
+    (define (cmp item-x item-y)
+      (define x (get-key item-x))
+      (define y (get-key item-y))
+      (cond
+        [(and (number? x) (number? y)) (< x y)]
+        [(and (string? x) (string? y)) (string<=? x y)]
+        [(and (number? x) (string? y)) #t]
+        [(and (string? x) (number? y)) #f]))
+    (define sorted-items (sort items cmp))
+    (for ([item (in-list sorted-items)]
+          [next-item (in-list (append (cdr sorted-items) (list #f)))])
+      (define item-key (get-key item))
+      (define next-item-key (and next-item (get-key next-item)))
+      (define add-sep?
+        (cond
+          [(and (number? item-key) (number? next-item-key))
+           (not (= (quotient item-key 100) (quotient next-item-key 100)))]
+          [(or (and (string? item-key) (string? next-item-key))
+               (not next-item-key))
+           #f]
+          [else #t]))
+      (send item restore)  
+      (when add-sep?
+        (new separator-menu-item% [parent show-menu]))))
   
   
   (define (create-root-menubar)
diff --git a/collects/drracket/private/interface.rkt b/collects/drracket/private/interface.rkt
index 007438bb57..bd4c5e2782 100644
--- a/collects/drracket/private/interface.rkt
+++ b/collects/drracket/private/interface.rkt
@@ -21,7 +21,8 @@ remain the same for tools that use them.
   (interface (frame:editor<%> frame:basics<%> frame:text-info<%>)
     get-show-menu
     update-shown
-    add-show-menu-items))
+    add-show-menu-items
+    set-show-menu-sort-key))
 
 (define unit:frame<%>
   (interface (frame:<%>
diff --git a/collects/drracket/private/tracing.rkt b/collects/drracket/private/tracing.rkt
index 0e27e4f2a5..fe6ff47243 100644
--- a/collects/drracket/private/tracing.rkt
+++ b/collects/drracket/private/tracing.rkt
@@ -162,7 +162,7 @@
   
   (define frame-mixin 
     (mixin (drracket:frame:<%> drracket:unit:frame<%>) ()
-      (inherit get-current-tab)
+      (inherit get-current-tab set-show-menu-sort-key)
       (define show-tracing-menu-item #f)
       (define tracing-visible? #f)
       
@@ -183,7 +183,8 @@
               (new menu-item%
                    (parent show-menu)
                    (label (string-constant tracing-show-tracing-window))
-                   (callback (lambda (x y) (toggle-tracing))))))
+                   (callback (lambda (x y) (toggle-tracing)))))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key show-tracing-menu-item 206))
       
       (define/public (show-tracing)
         (set! tracing-visible? #t)
diff --git a/collects/drracket/private/unit.rkt b/collects/drracket/private/unit.rkt
index a474c10108..db282ab04a 100644
--- a/collects/drracket/private/unit.rkt
+++ b/collects/drracket/private/unit.rkt
@@ -3190,7 +3190,8 @@ module browser threading seems wrong.
       (define/public (get-definitions/interactions-panel-parent)
         toolbar/rest-panel)
       
-      (inherit delegated-text-shown? hide-delegated-text show-delegated-text)
+      (inherit delegated-text-shown? hide-delegated-text show-delegated-text
+               set-show-menu-sort-key)
       (define/override (add-show-menu-items show-menu)
         (super add-show-menu-items show-menu)
         (set! definitions-item
@@ -3202,6 +3203,7 @@ module browser threading seems wrong.
                   (update-shown))
                 #\d
                 (string-constant definitions-menu-item-help-string)))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key definitions-item 101)
         (set! interactions-item
               (make-object menu:can-restore-menu-item%
                 (string-constant show-interactions-menu-item-label)
@@ -3211,49 +3213,52 @@ module browser threading seems wrong.
                   (update-shown))
                 #\e
                 (string-constant interactions-menu-item-help-string)))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key interactions-item 102)
         
-        (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
-             [label (string-constant use-horizontal-layout)]
-             [parent (get-show-menu)]
-             [callback (λ (x y) 
-                         (define vertical? (send resizable-panel get-vertical?)) 
-                         (preferences:set 'drracket:defs/ints-horizontal vertical?)
-                         (send resizable-panel set-orientation vertical?)
-                         (define update-shown? (or (not interactions-shown?)
-                                                   (not definitions-shown?)))
-                         (unless interactions-shown?
-                           (toggle-show/hide-interactions))
-                         (unless definitions-shown?
-                           (toggle-show/hide-definitions))
-                         (when update-shown?
-                           (update-shown)))]
-             [demand-callback
-              (λ (mi) (send mi set-label (if (send resizable-panel get-vertical?)
-                                             (string-constant use-horizontal-layout)
-                                             (string-constant use-vertical-layout))))]
-             [shortcut #\l]
-             [shortcut-prefix (cons 'shift (get-default-shortcut-prefix))])
+        (let ([layout-item
+               (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
+                    [label (string-constant use-horizontal-layout)]
+                    [parent (get-show-menu)]
+                    [callback (λ (x y) 
+                                (define vertical? (send resizable-panel get-vertical?)) 
+                                (preferences:set 'drracket:defs/ints-horizontal vertical?)
+                                (send resizable-panel set-orientation vertical?)
+                                (define update-shown? (or (not interactions-shown?)
+                                                          (not definitions-shown?)))
+                                (unless interactions-shown?
+                                  (toggle-show/hide-interactions))
+                                (unless definitions-shown?
+                                  (toggle-show/hide-definitions))
+                                (when update-shown?
+                                  (update-shown)))]
+                    [demand-callback
+                     (λ (mi) (send mi set-label (if (send resizable-panel get-vertical?)
+                                                    (string-constant use-horizontal-layout)
+                                                    (string-constant use-vertical-layout))))]
+                    [shortcut #\l]
+                    [shortcut-prefix (cons 'shift (get-default-shortcut-prefix))])])
+          (set-show-menu-sort-key layout-item 103))
         
-        (new separator-menu-item% [parent (get-show-menu)])
-        
-        (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
-             (shortcut #\u)
-             (label 
-              (if (delegated-text-shown?)
-                  (string-constant hide-overview)
-                  (string-constant show-overview)))
-             (parent (get-show-menu))
-             (callback
-              (λ (menu evt)
-                (if (delegated-text-shown?)
-                    (begin
-                      (send menu set-label (string-constant show-overview))
-                      (preferences:set 'framework:show-delegate? #f)
-                      (hide-delegated-text))
-                    (begin
-                      (send menu set-label (string-constant hide-overview))
-                      (preferences:set 'framework:show-delegate? #t)
-                      (show-delegated-text))))))
+        (let ([overview-menu-item 
+               (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
+                    (shortcut #\u)
+                    (label 
+                     (if (delegated-text-shown?)
+                         (string-constant hide-overview)
+                         (string-constant show-overview)))
+                    (parent (get-show-menu))
+                    (callback
+                     (λ (menu evt)
+                       (if (delegated-text-shown?)
+                           (begin
+                             (send menu set-label (string-constant show-overview))
+                             (preferences:set 'framework:show-delegate? #f)
+                             (hide-delegated-text))
+                           (begin
+                             (send menu set-label (string-constant hide-overview))
+                             (preferences:set 'framework:show-delegate? #t)
+                             (show-delegated-text))))))])
+          (set-show-menu-sort-key overview-menu-item 301))
         
         (set! module-browser-menu-item
               (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
@@ -3266,10 +3271,12 @@ module browser threading seems wrong.
                       (if module-browser-shown?
                           (hide-module-browser)
                           (show-module-browser))))))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key module-browser-menu-item 401)
         
         (set! toolbar-menu (new menu% 
                                 [parent show-menu]
                                 [label (string-constant toolbar)]))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key toolbar-menu 1)
         (set! toolbar-left-menu-item
               (new checkable-menu-item%
                    [label (string-constant toolbar-on-left)]
@@ -3300,7 +3307,43 @@ module browser threading seems wrong.
                    [label (string-constant show-log)]
                    [parent show-menu]
                    [callback
-                    (λ (x y) (send current-tab toggle-log))])))
+                    (λ (x y) (send current-tab toggle-log))]))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key logger-menu-item 205)
+        
+        
+        
+          
+        (set! show-line-numbers-menu-item
+              (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
+                   [label (if (show-line-numbers?)
+                              (string-constant hide-line-numbers/menu)
+                              (string-constant show-line-numbers/menu))]
+                   [parent (get-show-menu)]
+                   [callback (lambda (self event)
+                               (define value (preferences:get 'drracket:show-line-numbers?))
+                               (preferences:set 'drracket:show-line-numbers? (not value))
+                               (show-line-numbers! (not value)))]))
+        (set-show-menu-sort-key show-line-numbers-menu-item 302)
+        
+        (let ([split
+               (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
+                    (shortcut (if (eq? (system-type) 'macosx) #f #\m))
+                    (label (string-constant split-menu-item-label))
+                    (parent (get-show-menu))
+                    (callback (λ (x y) (split)))
+                    (demand-callback (λ (item) (split-demand item))))]
+              [collapse
+               (new menu:can-restore-menu-item% 
+                    (shortcut (if (eq? (system-type) 'macosx) #f #\m))
+                    (shortcut-prefix (if (eq? (system-type) 'macosx) 
+                                         (get-default-shortcut-prefix)
+                                         (cons 'shift (get-default-shortcut-prefix))))
+                    (label (string-constant collapse-menu-item-label))
+                    (parent (get-show-menu))
+                    (callback (λ (x y) (collapse)))
+                    (demand-callback (λ (item) (collapse-demand item))))])
+          (set-show-menu-sort-key split 2)
+          (set-show-menu-sort-key collapse 3)))
       
       
       ;                                                                                                       
@@ -4082,35 +4125,6 @@ module browser threading seems wrong.
               has-editor-on-demand)
             (register-capability-menu-item 'drscheme:special:insert-lambda insert-menu))
           
-          (set! show-line-numbers-menu-item
-                (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
-                     [label (if (show-line-numbers?)
-                                (string-constant hide-line-numbers/menu)
-                                (string-constant show-line-numbers/menu))]
-                     [parent (get-show-menu)]
-                     [callback (lambda (self event)
-                                 (define value (preferences:get 'drracket:show-line-numbers?))
-                                 (preferences:set 'drracket:show-line-numbers? (not value))
-                                 (show-line-numbers! (not value)))]))
-          
-          (make-object separator-menu-item% (get-show-menu))
-          
-          (new menu:can-restore-menu-item%
-               (shortcut (if (eq? (system-type) 'macosx) #f #\m))
-               (label (string-constant split-menu-item-label))
-               (parent (get-show-menu))
-               (callback (λ (x y) (split)))
-               (demand-callback (λ (item) (split-demand item))))
-          (new menu:can-restore-menu-item% 
-               (shortcut (if (eq? (system-type) 'macosx) #f #\m))
-               (shortcut-prefix (if (eq? (system-type) 'macosx) 
-                                    (get-default-shortcut-prefix)
-                                    (cons 'shift (get-default-shortcut-prefix))))
-               (label (string-constant collapse-menu-item-label))
-               (parent (get-show-menu))
-               (callback (λ (x y) (collapse)))
-               (demand-callback (λ (item) (collapse-demand item))))
-          
           (frame:reorder-menus this)))
       
       (define/public (jump-to-previous-error-loc)
diff --git a/collects/scribblings/tools/frame.scrbl b/collects/scribblings/tools/frame.scrbl
index 16afd84b27..d4185cc50b 100644
--- a/collects/scribblings/tools/frame.scrbl
+++ b/collects/scribblings/tools/frame.scrbl
@@ -1,5 +1,5 @@
 #lang scribble/doc
-@(require "common.rkt")
+@(require "common.rkt" scribble/core)
 @(tools-title "frame")
 
 @defclass[drracket:frame:name-message% canvas% ()]{
@@ -191,27 +191,69 @@ This interface is the result of the @racket[drracket:frame:basics-mixin]
            void?]{
 @methspec{
 
-This method is called during the construction of the view
-menu.  This method is intended to be overridden. It is
-expected to add other Show/Hide menu items to the show menu.
+This method is called during the construction of the @onscreen{View}
+menu.  This method is intended to be overridden with the
+overriding methods adding other Show/Hide menu items to the @onscreen{View}
+menu.
 
 See also
+@method[drracket:frame:<%> set-show-menu-sort-key] and
 @method[drracket:frame:<%> get-show-menu].
-
 }
 @methimpl{
-
-Does nothing.
-
-
-
+  Does nothing.
 }}
 
+@defmethod[(set-show-menu-sort-key [item (is-a?/c menu-item<%>)]
+                                   [key (and/c real? positive?)])
+           void?]{
+  Controls the ordering of items in the @onscreen{View} menu.
+                                        
+The number determines the sorting order and where separators in the menu appear
+(smaller numbers first). 
+
+These are the numbers for many of the @onscreen{View} menu items that come
+built-in to DrRacket:
+@table[(style #f '())
+       (let ()
+         (define (add-blocks lol)
+           (for/list ([strs (in-list lol)])
+             (for/list ([str (in-list (reverse strs))]
+                        [i (in-naturals)])
+               @paragraph[(style #f '()) 
+                          (if (zero? i)
+                              (list str "\ua0\ua0\ua0\ua0\ua0")
+                              str)])))
+         (add-blocks
+          (list (list @racket[1] @onscreen{Toolbar})
+                (list @racket[2] @onscreen{Split})
+                (list @racket[3] @onscreen{Collapse})
+                (list @racket[101] @onscreen{Show Definitions})
+                (list @racket[102] @onscreen{Show Interactions})
+                (list @racket[103] @onscreen{Use Horizontal Layout})
+                (list @racket[205] @onscreen{Show Log})
+                (list @racket[206] @onscreen{Show Tracing})
+                (list @racket[207] @onscreen{Hide Profile})
+                (list @racket[301] @onscreen{Show Program Contour})
+                (list @racket[302] @onscreen{Show Line Numbers})
+                (list @racket[401] @onscreen{Show Module Browser}))))]
+
+In addition, a separator is inserted for each 100. So, for example,
+a separator is inserted between @onscreen{Collapse} and
+@onscreen{Show Definitions}.
+
+Note that the argument may be a rational number,
+effectively allowing insertion between any two menu items already in the menu.
+For this reason, avoid using @racket[0], or any number is that @racket[0]
+modulo @racket[100].
+
+}
+                 
 @defmethod[(get-show-menu)
            (is-a?/c menu%)]{
 @index{View menu}
 
-returns the view menu, for use by the
+returns the @onscreen{View} menu, for use by the
 @method[drracket:frame:<%> update-shown] method.
 
 See also
@@ -219,7 +261,7 @@ See also
 
 The method (and others) uses the word @tt{show} to preserve
 backwards compatibility from when the menu itself was named
-the Show menu.
+the @onscreen{Show} menu.
 
 }